T. Harry Williams Center for Oral
History Collection
ABSTRACT
INTERVIEWEE NAME: Theodore "Ted"
Schirmer # 4700.0981
IDENTIFICATION: Vietnam veteran
INTERVIEWER: Robert Talley
PROJECT: Americans in Vietnam
DATES: 11/19/74
FOCUS DATES: July 9, 1966-April 5, 1970; Feb
3, 1967-Sept 10, 1968
ABSTRACT:
Tape 1430, Side A
Birthplace, parent's divorce; mother's remarriage to a musician,
Ted moved around constantly as child; financial ups and downs in
childhood; changed schools frequently; lived in Las Vegas, Nevada
for six years; moved to Baton Rouge; sports and part time job in
Baton Rouge; ran away, returned to Las Vegas; belonged to gangs
in Vegas; job at Denny's restaurant in Vegas re-enrolled in high
school; importance of education; influence of his step family;
worries about his grades; returned to his Baton Rouge, finished
high school; integration of Istrouma High School; friends with
Rosetta, the only black student in his high school, and trouble
this caused him; students' attitudes toward Rosetta; racial
incident in St. Louis; brother who joined Navy; John Wayne
movies, culture of war; course work at Istrouma High School;
interest in Vietnam war; planned to attend LSU after graduation
on track scholarship; joined Navy; comparison of boot camps for
different branches of service; psychological manipulation,
humiliation, during boot camp; useless training in Navy boot
camp; humiliating remedial boot camp called "4050";
suicide attempts of guys in 4050; escape attempt from boot camp;
Filipinos in the Navy; other abuses in 4050; laundry and shoe
shining scam during boot camp; boot camp hierarchy; negotiating
what position he'd have on ship; worked on operations on Mekong
riverways; petty officers were usually misfits; volunteering for
unpopular assignment; father's WWII service; training in various
places.
1430, Side B
Sadistic POW camp simulation during training; reality of POW
situation; experiences of an American POW; arrival in Vietnam on
rattletrap airplane; seeing American bodies unloaded from plane;
plane that was shot up, pilot injured; harassment attacks; people
he knew who were killed in Vietnam; ratio of worry to likelihood
of dying; US soldiers who went crazy, tied up everyone in camp;
spent eight months in Vung Tau building a camp; Schirmer learned
Vietnamese, transferred down to Cat Lo (?); watching B-52
strikes; became interpreter, by Tet of 1968 couldn't trust ARVNs;
learned language by mingling with people, participating in their
culture; American opinions on Vietnamese; saw American convoy run
over a Vietnamese child; Schirmer alienated from other US
soldiers because of his interest in the Vietnamese people;
married a Vietnamese woman in a Buddhist ceremony, had a child,
rented a village from an ex-Viet Minh whose son was VC; came to
understand the VC as revolutionaries; Ho Chi Minh as local hero;
realized he was fighting an imperialistic war; corporate
interests involved in war; NVA responding to US aggression;
Schirmer sent home early because he was "going
Asiatic"; low opinion of commanding officers; dangerous
power of commanding officers; altercation with commanding
officer; weaponry, Schirmer's responsibility cleaning weapons;
volunteered for chopper missions; battles between VC and
Australians; enjoyed flying missions; never killed anyone, as far
as he can tell for sure; morbid dreams of going home dead as a
hero; suspected John Wayne movies had influenced him; lots of
people over there had similar fantasies of heroism; later in the
war, more people drafted who didn't want to be there; war as
traditional male rite of passage; Vietnam veterans who feel
guilty now; change in attitude of American public; when his
mother died, military flew him home on emergency leave, he took
"coffin flight," plane full of dead bodies; growing
anti-war sentiment by 1968; racial trouble in Vietnam when Martin
Luther King, Jr. assassinated; Vietnamese people thrilled by his
command of language; Schirmer lived in VC neighborhood, unafraid;
adopted Vietnamese food, and clothing; almost got shot by
Americans one night because of his black pajamas; Vietnamese
attitudes toward Americans; US caused war to escalate; Schirmer's
wife Hue in Vietnam.
Tape 1431, Side A
TAPE IS VERY MESSED UP, GOES IN AND OUT OF COMPREHENSIBILITY
First personal contacts with Vietnamese civilians were with
Mamasans; friend who got Vietnamese woman pregnant; commanding
officer punishing friend for impregnating woman; Schirmer's
troubles with superior officers; amazing power of his
communist-hating commanding officer; ; communists killed whole
families; met Hue during Tet of 1968, was his wife there;
definition of "wife"; VC confiscated all his stuff;
enjoyed living in VC area because not many US military
authorities around there; Schirmer accepted by people there, only
worried during early morning hours.
Tape 1431, Side B
Tape is blank
Tape 1432, Side A
Marriage arrangement helped protect his property; Vietnamese
police could confiscate possessions of Americans; offered to
marry her legally when he found out she was pregnant, but she
didn't want to leave her family; later she changed her mind but
too difficult; problems with Vietnamese postal system; wife Hue
sympathetic toward the VC, because she could relate to them as
patriots; Schirmer witnessed so-called free election in Vietnam,
saw how it was controlled; dictators in Vietnam; demographics of
people who fled Vietnam when Ho Chi Minh took power; majority of
Vietnamese would rather end war and become one country under
North Vietnam; communists will slaughter people who caused war,
kept it going; "black market" is misleading term; black
market trade in stereos, cigarettes, liquor; R&R trip to
Saigon and Bangkok; stayed in hotel in Saigon where American
deserters lived; scam involving taxi cabs and stolen ration
cards; scams in Bangkok; US military bases cause black market
activity; bribing police with packs of Salem cigarettes;
corruption among military police; Oriental people are looser,
more tolerant; in Christianity, we can't be what we really are
without sin and shame; Asians understand life and human nature
better; whole markets of American products in Saigon; black
market availability of hard to get items; excitement of being
only 19 years old and having unlimited access to liquor and
prostitutes; anti-prostitute propaganda; realization that the
government lies to public; prices for different grades of
prostitutes; little boys touting their sisters and mothers;
prevalence of prostitution; massage parlor that specialized in
oral sex; Schirmer used to get cheaper rates because he was so
well known there; barber shop at massage parlor; techniques of
barbers; had to buy bar girls "Saigon tea"; costs of
bar girls, overnights; bar girls were better educated, spoke good
English, made lots of money; bar girls bought and sold bars, lost
money and bars gambling; GIs who were too uptight to visit
prostitutes; gambling, playing cards, gambling at gin rummy and
tic tac toe; French solitaire; Chinese games, dice; prevalence of
drugs; marijuana and opium both laced with heroin; Vietnamese
replaced tobacco in cigarettes with marijuana, resealed cartons;
smuggling marijuana; smoking opium with his landlord; hemp and
George Washington; increased number of draftees changed
attitudes, drug use; marijuana didn't affect Schirmer when he
tried it in Vietnam; harmlessness of marijuana and opium; hearing
about anti-war sentiment in US, riots, assassinations; military
press, the Stars and Stripes, reported everything as
communist-motivated; when he returned to US, had anti-peacenik
sentiment; finding out that the government was full of bullshit
and lies; US shouldn't have been in Vietnam; escalating; US has
to get in trouble since it has such a huge military; oil in South
China Sea; LBJ's aims; Gulf of Tonkin affair.
Tape 1432, Side B
Gulf of Tonkin affair; Vietnam war was the fault of the American
people; Schirmer wants to organize people not to stand for this
sort of thing; corporations and military.
TAPES: 3
TOTAL PLAYING TIME: 4 hours
# PAGES TRANSCRIPT: 7 page index
RESTRICTIONS: none